| 09:01:26 | * | stevenknight (n=stevenkn@c-69-181-234-155.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #scons |
| 09:01:41 | stevenknight | good morning... |
| 09:01:43 | Greg_Noel | stevenknight, hello |
| 09:01:55 | Greg_Noel | Nobody else here, yet? |
| 09:01:59 | CoryCohen | Hi |
| 09:02:09 | stevenknight | CoryCohen: hi |
| 09:02:09 | Greg_Noel | Hello, you here for the bug party? |
| 09:02:18 | CoryCohen | Yeah, just to lurk really. |
| 09:02:25 | CoryCohen | Did you see me email to the dev list? |
| 09:02:48 | Greg_Noel | probably; what was the subject? |
| 09:02:59 | stevenknight | yeah, the object file scanner for link dependencies? |
| 09:03:03 | CoryCohen | Automatic link dependency generation using nm. |
| 09:03:23 | Greg_Noel | Yeah, that's on my queue to answer after the bug party. |
| 09:03:33 | CoryCohen | Ok. I'll be patient then. :-) |
| 09:03:46 | Greg_Noel | You probably have the scanner attached at the wrong place. |
| 09:03:52 | stevenknight | my initial reaction: +1 |
| 09:03:53 | CoryCohen | You guys have got plenty to do today it looks like. |
| 09:04:16 | Greg_Noel | But no quorum yet |
| 09:04:29 | stevenknight | i think you're just not setting up the scanner quite right |
| 09:04:41 | stevenknight | scanning generated files works just fine for things like generated .h files |
| 09:04:52 | stevenknight | but it can be a little non-obvious how to do it |
| 09:04:56 | CoryCohen | That's likely. I just started using SCons. |
| 09:05:07 | stevenknight | in principle scanning objects should be like scanning generated .h files |
| 09:06:27 | CoryCohen | How much more is there to it then: linkscan = Scanner(function=mylinkscan, skeys=['.o']) |
| 09:06:38 | CoryCohen | env.Append(SCANNERS=linkscan) |
| 09:08:20 | stevenknight | you also have to hook it up to the specific Builder involved |
| 09:08:38 | stevenknight | scanning for dependencies is not purely a function of the source file type (i.e., the .o suffix) |
| 09:08:54 | CoryCohen | Oh... The example had a Command builder, but I didn't think that was relevant. |
| 09:08:54 | stevenknight | it's always done within the context of a specific target file that's being generated |
| 09:09:14 | CoryCohen | Is there some magic I use to get the default object builder? |
| 09:09:18 | stevenknight | the dependencies that you generate from a .o file are appropriate for linking into an executable |
| 09:09:26 | CoryCohen | Yes. |
| 09:09:34 | stevenknight | but they'd be different if you were doing something else with the .o file |
| 09:09:47 | CoryCohen | (nods) |
| 09:09:53 | stevenknight | yeah, "magic" is right... |
| 09:10:12 | stevenknight | it's not something that's as easily configurable as it should be |
| 09:10:48 | stevenknight | hang on a sec... looking... |
| 09:10:53 | CoryCohen | Ok. |
| 09:12:06 | stevenknight | in Tool/__init__.py, there are create{Prog,StaticLib,SharedLib,Object}Builder() functions |
| 09:12:23 | stevenknight | that create the default builders for those types of things |
| 09:12:38 | stevenknight | you can grep in Tool/*.py for examples of different tool modules that use them to add additional things |
| 09:12:56 | CoryCohen | Great. Thanks. |
| 09:13:01 | stevenknight | suffixes, emitters, etc. |
| 09:13:20 | stevenknight | there may be some additional surgery required, but keep asking when you get blocked |
| 09:13:36 | stevenknight | Greg: looks like it might be me and you again |
| 09:13:45 | Greg_Noel | Yeah |
| 09:13:49 | stevenknight | shall we get started? |
| 09:14:00 | Greg_Noel | I only have one new point after last time |
| 09:14:17 | stevenknight | ?new point |
| 09:14:44 | Greg_Noel | I was going over the issues and I noticed that 1872 was submitted by David |
| 09:15:24 | Greg_Noel | I hadn't noticed that the first time |
| 09:15:41 | Greg_Noel | With that the case, I propose to give it to him |
| 09:15:53 | stevenknight | +1 |
| 09:16:19 | Greg_Noel | Then as far as I know, there's nothing that we didn't discuss last time |
| 09:16:29 | stevenknight | i was scanning editlist2008 before and had one change of heart |
| 09:16:38 | Greg_Noel | Which? |
| 09:16:48 | stevenknight | Bill's argument that we add the BuildDir() deprecation warning for 1.0 makes sense to me |
| 09:17:09 | stevenknight | that's #1906 |
| 09:17:22 | Greg_Noel | I think it's too soon |
| 09:17:42 | stevenknight | for just a warning? |
| 09:18:12 | Greg_Noel | Well, I don't use it, so I won't fight it, but ... |
| 09:18:31 | Greg_Noel | ... those that do could be annoyed. |
| 09:18:57 | stevenknight | true |
| 09:19:23 | stevenknight | but they'll be annoyed when it happens in 1.x, too |
| 09:19:25 | Greg_Noel | Given that it's so misunderstood, how many users do you think it has? |
| 09:19:40 | stevenknight | excellent question |
| 09:19:57 | HM2 | Can anyone tell me how I can get scons to activate SConstruct files in subdirectories? |
| 09:20:01 | stevenknight | probably fairly common |
| 09:20:13 | Greg_Noel | Then they need time to switch. |
| 09:20:16 | stevenknight | HM2: hang on a sec while we finish this thread |
| 09:20:30 | HM2 | k.. |
| 09:21:11 | stevenknight | how much time? |
| 09:21:20 | Greg_Noel | There have been deprecation warnings for Copy() ==> Clone() for a year |
| 09:21:45 | Greg_Noel | I don't think it really needs more than a few months, but 1.1 sounds reasonable. |
| 09:22:52 | Greg_Noel | (See, I think there will be a 1.1.) |
| 09:23:09 | stevenknight | guess I can live with that, provided our "THIS WILL CHANGE" warnings in the doc are prominent enough |
| 09:23:10 | stevenknight | are they? |
| 09:23:19 | stevenknight | agree re: there being a likely 1.1 |
| 09:23:46 | Greg_Noel | I think you need the BIG CAPS, but yes; I certainly see them. |
| 09:24:06 | Greg_Noel | ... but then, I'm a reader, I actually _see_ what's in the print. |
| 09:24:30 | stevenknight | that definitely differentiates you from the great mass of us who mostly just skim... :-) |
| 09:24:34 | CoryCohen | It is two rather small sentences. |
| 09:25:14 | stevenknight | CoryCohen: good point |
| 09:25:43 | stevenknight | so let's leave 1906 for 1.x |
| 09:25:59 | stevenknight | but add another item for 0.98.1 to enhance the warnings in the doc: |
| 09:26:08 | Greg_Noel | I actually like the schedule that's in the wiki... |
| 09:26:13 | stevenknight | indented "IMPORTANT NOTE:" block quotes or something |
| 09:26:26 | Greg_Noel | ... one release with a doc warning |
| 09:26:47 | Greg_Noel | ... one release with a compile warning that can be turned off |
| 09:26:54 | Greg_Noel | ... one release with a compile warning that can't be turned off |
| 09:27:14 | Greg_Noel | ... one release with a fatal error |
| 09:27:48 | Greg_Noel | The block quote for emphasis sounds reasonable |
| 09:28:01 | stevenknight | where "one release" is a major (x.y) release, not something like 0.98.1, yes? |
| 09:28:18 | Greg_Noel | That's minor release, but yes |
| 09:28:32 | stevenknight | okay |
| 09:28:58 | stevenknight | so i'll open a 0.98.1 issue to add block quotes |
| 09:29:06 | stevenknight | and 1906 is 1.x |
| 09:29:46 | Greg_Noel | Remember, we were figuring a new release, whether major or minor, three to four times a year, so three to four months each |
| 09:30:13 | stevenknight | so minimum case that's about a year of lead time |
| 09:30:15 | stevenknight | should be reasonable |
| 09:32:02 | stevenknight | HM2: SConstruct files in subdirectories |
| 09:32:08 | stevenknight | there's nothing magic about the file name 'SConscript' |
| 09:32:21 | stevenknight | you should be able to just put |
| 09:32:28 | stevenknight | SConscript("subdir/SConstruct") |
| 09:32:36 | HM2 | ...right |
| 09:32:39 | stevenknight | in any file and it will read up the subsidiary |
| 09:32:47 | HM2 | well atm i'm still trying to get a seperate builddir |
| 09:33:44 | stevenknight | the tricky part with subsidiary SConstruct files is the .sconsign files that store the build information |
| 09:34:22 | stevenknight | separate builddir: do you mean a separate build variant, or a directory in which you want to stick all your object files from across the project? |
| 09:34:28 | HM2 | is SConstruct == SConscript? |
| 09:34:58 | stevenknight | all SCons config files are just Python scripts that get executed to set up the dependencies and stuff |
| 09:35:00 | HM2 | well ideally i'd like to have src/some/random/path mimicked in both build/some/random/path and include/some/random/path |
| 09:35:16 | stevenknight | the only magic name is SConstruct, which we use as the top level of the build |
| 09:35:26 | stevenknight | everything else is just convention |
| 09:35:41 | stevenknight | you include them in the build by calling SConscript(), but they can be named anything |
| 09:36:08 | HM2 | ;( |
| 09:37:08 | Greg_Noel | HM2, builddir doesn't do dual mimicry |
| 09:37:40 | stevenknight | actually it does (or is supposed to); what would the mimicked include/some/random/path be used for? |
| 09:38:10 | stevenknight | if it doesn't have any actual built targets then SCons may not "realize" that you intend files to physically show up there |
| 09:38:30 | Greg_Noel | To construct the install tree; we've been at this point before |
| 09:38:38 | HM2 | hmm |
| 09:38:54 | HM2 | this is odd |
| 09:39:11 | stevenknight | ??? oh, discusing this before I showed up? |
| 09:39:19 | Greg_Noel | What builddir does is create a virtual copy of the source tree so you can build a variant in it. |
| 09:39:27 | HM2 | i use env = Environment (CPPPATH = 'include' in my "src" dir and it builds fine...include is ../include relative to "src" |
| 09:39:50 | HM2 | but with a build dir it expects to find build/include |
| 09:40:09 | Greg_Noel | No, we've been 'round it on the mailing list; that's what (forgot name) really wants from builddir when he says it doesn't work like it should |
| 09:41:04 | stevenknight | okay, I thought this might have been a quick question to handle |
| 09:41:11 | stevenknight | but it sounds like we need to go into more depth |
| 09:41:19 | stevenknight | didn't mean to derail the bug dicussion to this extent |
| 09:41:21 | HM2 | scons doesn't correct include paths when it uses a build dir? |
| 09:41:41 | Greg_Noel | HM2, if you made an exact copy of the source, then built in it, that's what you'd expect. |
| 09:42:00 | stevenknight | Greg's exactly right |
| 09:42:06 | HM2 | ah it builds! |
| 09:42:22 | HM2 | at last some sanity |
| 09:42:30 | Greg_Noel | no quorum, why not? |
| 09:42:50 | stevenknight | hmm, that might be the first time I've heard "sanity" used in a discussion of BuildDir()... :-) |
| 09:42:57 | Greg_Noel | concur! |
| 09:43:12 | HM2 | and it didn't copy my source files! |
| 09:43:13 | HM2 | wowza |
| 09:43:24 | stevenknight | HM2: you're using duplicate=0? |
| 09:43:28 | HM2 | yes |
| 09:43:34 | stevenknight | yeah, that's the way it should work, then |
| 09:44:01 | HM2 | right, 1 more question, how can I get it to pass multiple source files to gcc (or the compiler) at once |
| 09:44:10 | HM2 | possibly? |
| 09:44:13 | stevenknight | ah, batch builders...! |
| 09:44:14 | HM2 | with Object()? |
| 09:44:20 | Greg_Noel | can't, see issue 1086 |
| 09:44:26 | stevenknight | yes |
| 09:44:42 | stevenknight | you'd have to basically do your own custom Builder or Command right now |
| 09:45:18 | stevenknight | we're discussing how to extend our model to support it more naturally |
| 09:45:34 | HM2 | I see |
| 09:45:50 | HM2 | doesn't python support nested lists? seems the obvious way to do it |
| 09:46:05 | stevenknight | you can pretty easily set up a custom Builder of command line that uses $SOURCES to get more than one source file on the command line |
| 09:46:06 | Greg_Noel | ah, er, um, Java |
| 09:46:08 | * | JimRandall (n=jim@66.119.167.101) has joined #scons |
| 09:46:22 | Greg_Noel | JimRandall, you're late.... |
| 09:46:24 | stevenknight | the trick is that SCons won't (by default) realize that multiple .o files get created from it |
| 09:46:51 | JimRandall | Indeed - better late than never :) |
| 09:47:00 | stevenknight | but Jim's here! better than some others... |
| 09:47:05 | stevenknight | yes |
| 09:47:17 | Greg_Noel | No quorum, so we've been chatting... |
| 09:47:36 | HM2 | stevenknight : no i mean multiple .c files into one .o file |
| 09:47:44 | Greg_Noel | Does three constitute a quorum? |
| 09:47:57 | stevenknight | most substantive decision so far has been to *not* enable deprecation warnings for BuildDir until 1.x |
| 09:48:15 | stevenknight | but for 0.98.1 enhance the warnings in the doc with caps or block quotes |
| 09:48:27 | JimRandall | And maybe a few large arrows |
| 09:48:28 | stevenknight | I'd say three is sufficient |
| 09:48:28 | Greg_Noel | (both) |
| 09:48:54 | JimRandall | Thought I don't use it, so I'd not notice it anyway :) |
| 09:48:59 | stevenknight | if we keep postponing things waiting for enough people to participate, it'll never happen |
| 09:49:18 | Greg_Noel | true, shall we start? |
| 09:49:32 | stevenknight | yes, let's create the momentum and let others catch up to the train |
| 09:49:50 | stevenknight | once they realize we're making all sorts of decisions they disagree with... :-) |
| 09:50:10 | Greg_Noel | ok, 449? (shudder) |
| 09:50:37 | stevenknight | HM2: your best bet right now for multiple .c files into one .o file is to do a custom Command() |
| 09:50:44 | stevenknight | yes, 449: |
| 09:51:08 | Greg_Noel | I have to admit I don't understand it |
| 09:51:16 | Greg_Noel | Gary was carrying this ball |
| 09:51:41 | stevenknight | 449: future, p3, put gary's name on it |
| 09:51:45 | Greg_Noel | done |
| 09:51:53 | stevenknight | if it languishes it's because there isn't enough demand anyway |
| 09:52:03 | Greg_Noel | 468? |
| 09:52:03 | JimRandall | aye - doesn't seem that critical |
| 09:52:22 | stevenknight | 468: how about turning this into a doc issue? |
| 09:52:33 | Greg_Noel | hmmm... possible |
| 09:52:34 | stevenknight | just show people how to use atexit for this pattern? |
| 09:52:45 | Greg_Noel | yes, I like it. done |
| 09:52:50 | JimRandall | Aye |
| 09:52:51 | Greg_Noel | when? |
| 09:53:05 | stevenknight | 1.0 |
| 09:53:13 | stevenknight | with all the other User's Guide things |
| 09:53:24 | Greg_Noel | ok, I'll make it yours. |
| 09:53:28 | stevenknight | anything that we can't actually finish by then will get promoted en masse to 1. |
| 09:53:29 | stevenknight | 1.x |
| 09:53:33 | stevenknight | yes, mine |
| 09:54:05 | Greg_Noel | 505, future. _far_ future. |
| 09:54:13 | stevenknight | skip 484? |
| 09:54:31 | Greg_Noel | oops |
| 09:54:42 | stevenknight | 484: 1.x, but I'm not sure who |
| 09:55:09 | stevenknight | might as well be me if there's no one else obvious |
| 09:55:14 | Greg_Noel | I'd do it, but I've never hacked that area |
| 09:55:49 | stevenknight | yeah, and it's one of those tool-incompatibility things that's really easy to fix for one and break others without knowing it... :-/ |
| 09:55:51 | Greg_Noel | I can certainly add a note to explain the problem more clearly; that might make it easier. |
| 09:56:01 | HM2 | scons -c doesn't kill empty directories in the build directory then? |
| 09:56:06 | HM2 | even though it creates them |
| 09:56:24 | Greg_Noel | HM2, nope, not as a rule. unfortunately. |
| 09:56:25 | stevenknight | HM2: correct, no one's come up with code to do it |
| 09:57:01 | Greg_Noel | does that work for 484? |
| 09:57:04 | stevenknight | HM2: it's hard to know when a directory is a build by-product vs. something that people intend to leave there |
| 09:57:05 | HM2 | odly i'm now getting /build/build/geometry |
| 09:57:25 | Greg_Noel | Take the 'builddir' out of your subdirs. |
| 09:57:33 | HM2 | i see |
| 09:57:43 | stevenknight | 484: 1.x, P3, assign to me, add the note you were talking about |
| 09:57:48 | Greg_Noel | done |
| 09:57:58 | Greg_Noel | next 505> |
| 09:58:06 | stevenknight | 505: i don't think it's that far off |
| 09:58:42 | stevenknight | and, honestly, it bugs me that waf makes a big deal of having it |
| 09:58:47 | Greg_Noel | I just see no reason for it, but then, I've used stone-age tools since the stone age |
| 09:58:56 | HM2 | aweosme |
| 09:59:00 | HM2 | this is working well |
| 09:59:14 | stevenknight | HM2: cool, glad to hear it |
| 09:59:26 | stevenknight | HM2: a little tricky to get set up, but it's slick once everything's in place |
| 09:59:44 | * | HM2 now has to play with install() ? |
| 09:59:47 | Greg_Noel | Jim, an opinion? I'll not stand in the way. |
| 09:59:54 | stevenknight | the build log part of 505 becomes really necessary for continuous integration systems |
| 09:59:59 | JimRandall | I'm a monochrome kind of guy myself |
| 10:00:16 | JimRandall | Though I seem to be in the minority there too :) |
| 10:00:18 | stevenknight | how about splitting 505? |
| 10:00:44 | Greg_Noel | how? |
| 10:01:00 | stevenknight | i can see the color being a nice-to-have, but logging is downright useful |
| 10:01:21 | stevenknight | i guess I don't want to see the latter get pushed out because we're iffy about colorizing output |
| 10:01:28 | JimRandall | Agreed - logging was one of the very first things I bolted on top of scons |
| 10:01:51 | stevenknight | how about give it me and mark it research? |
| 10:01:56 | Greg_Noel | Being a UNIX guy, I just use tee. |
| 10:02:12 | stevenknight | can't just use tee in a continuous integration system like Buildbot or Pulse |
| 10:02:14 | Greg_Noel | ok, done, research, steven |
| 10:02:32 | Greg_Noel | Er, I do, works fine. |
| 10:02:53 | stevenknight | ??? |
| 10:03:09 | stevenknight | oh, i get it |
| 10:03:16 | Greg_Noel | trust me, more than one way to skin a cat |
| 10:03:35 | stevenknight | sorry, i'm thinking of using it in conjunction with -j |
| 10:03:47 | stevenknight | intermixed error messages |
| 10:03:59 | Greg_Noel | different problem |
| 10:03:59 | JimRandall | Now that would be an interesting use of colourization too |
| 10:04:09 | stevenknight | yeah, you're right, i'm getting them mixed up |
| 10:04:29 | stevenknight | i was thinking of it as a -j issue because the only time i use it is in buidlbot |
| 10:04:48 | stevenknight | sorry, i've taken us down a rathole again... |
| 10:04:53 | stevenknight | 513? |
| 10:05:24 | Greg_Noel | I think the whole issue of suffixes needs work, but it may not be this issue. |
| 10:05:55 | stevenknight | agreed |
| 10:06:05 | stevenknight | i've taken a run at this once or twice but never got far enough |
| 10:07:02 | Greg_Noel | I suspect this one needs to be closed and a new issue opened that's more focused. |
| 10:07:12 | stevenknight | it's really dumb, though, that other suffixes can be configure and this one can't |
| 10:07:46 | Greg_Noel | (they can?) |
| 10:07:59 | stevenknight | i believe so... |
| 10:08:11 | Greg_Noel | hmmm... |
| 10:08:11 | stevenknight | we do support the following variables: |
| 10:08:43 | stevenknight | $CPPSUFFIXES, $DSUFFIXES, $IDLSUFFIXES, $LATEXSUFFIXES, $LIBSUFFIXES, $FORTRANSUFFIXES... |
| 10:09:20 | HM2 | I presume to pass environment junk to SConscript()'d files I need to export or something? |
| 10:09:23 | stevenknight | now i don't remember why I didn't "just solve" this if other languages have a working pattern to copy |
| 10:09:33 | HM2 | to the environment |
| 10:09:57 | stevenknight | HM2: yes, check out the Export() function or the export= argument to SConscript() |
| 10:10:09 | stevenknight | HM2: and Import() on the SConscript side |
| 10:11:08 | Greg_Noel | I guess I don't know how those work, but I thought it required loading a Tool, and we already load too many of them. |
| 10:11:31 | stevenknight | back to 513: give it to me, 2.x, p2 |
| 10:11:38 | Greg_Noel | It's that part that I think needs significant speedup. |
| 10:11:45 | Greg_Noel | ok, done; next? |
| 10:11:48 | stevenknight | agreed re: speedup |
| 10:11:57 | stevenknight | it shouldn't require a new tool, just making the existing one smarter |
| 10:12:21 | Greg_Noel | And maybe some way to configure it _without_ loading all the Tools. |
| 10:12:36 | stevenknight | 555: this is less crucial with Anatoly's scons.bat fix |
| 10:12:43 | HM2 | I am very very impressed |
| 10:12:46 | stevenknight | (agree re: configuration without loading more tools) |
| 10:13:06 | Greg_Noel | 555, not of interest to a UNIX guy ;-} |
| 10:13:11 | stevenknight | :-) |
| 10:13:26 | HM2 | no annoying MACRO_LANGUAGE_GARBAGE, Scons seems clean |
| 10:13:39 | stevenknight | now that we scons.bat is smarter, 555 should just be part of overall Windows installation fixing |
| 10:13:48 | Greg_Noel | pick your poison on it; I'll go along |
| 10:13:49 | JimRandall | sounds good |
| 10:14:03 | stevenknight | let's just close this one, the Windows installation is recorded elsewhere |
| 10:14:19 | stevenknight | FIXED by the scons.bat change, dup it to the one I just integrated |
| 10:14:27 | stevenknight | let me get a number for you... |
| 10:15:18 | stevenknight | 555 is dup 1882 |
| 10:15:40 | stevenknight | 561: |
| 10:15:44 | Greg_Noel | typing ahead, 561 said CVS('subdir/file') |
| 10:16:13 | Greg_Noel | rather than 'CVS(.)' n the subdir |
| 10:16:25 | Greg_Noel | oops, modulo quoting |
| 10:16:26 | stevenknight | ah! okay, i get it |
| 10:16:28 | stevenknight | INVALID |
| 10:16:31 | Greg_Noel | done |
| 10:16:52 | stevenknight | 633: windows installation |
| 10:16:53 | Greg_Noel | skip 646 |
| 10:17:19 | Greg_Noel | oops, I'm off again. |
| 10:17:51 | Greg_Noel | yes, defer until we know about GSoC project |
| 10:17:58 | stevenknight | agreed |
| 10:18:49 | Greg_Noel | 646 |
| 10:19:04 | Greg_Noel | (been so long I've forgotten this) |
| 10:19:34 | stevenknight | 646: 2.x, me, p3 |
| 10:19:57 | stevenknight | we're just not consistent about how we do this searching-for-tools thing |
| 10:20:25 | Greg_Noel | I'll add a note to it; should be possible with Dir('bin') |
| 10:20:47 | Greg_Noel | 648 |
| 10:20:48 | stevenknight | okay, cool |
| 10:21:23 | stevenknight | 648: I agree with you: 1.x, p4 |
| 10:21:23 | Greg_Noel | DOS, ick. |
| 10:21:33 | JimRandall | 648 not too hard to do, and would be handy |
| 10:21:48 | JimRandall | Can send that one to me. |
| 10:21:54 | stevenknight | Jim, you interested? If not, I might be able to look at it as part of.. |
| 10:21:54 | Greg_Noel | done, both |
| 10:21:55 | stevenknight | okay... |
| 10:22:06 | stevenknight | 659: |
| 10:22:50 | stevenknight | more windows command line, Jim you okay with taking this one too? |
| 10:23:09 | JimRandall | Aye, that windows? |
| 10:23:15 | * | bdbaddog2007 (n=Tiger@adsl-71-142-98-36.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) has joined #scons |
| 10:23:27 | stevenknight | Bill! |
| 10:23:33 | Greg_Noel | Stylishly late? |
| 10:23:43 | stevenknight | we gave you lots and lots and LOTS of action items... :-) |
| 10:23:53 | CoryCohen | Sorry, bit late here... 659 works just fine for me. |
| 10:23:57 | bdbaddog2007 | G'morning.. Yes weekend mornings are difficult for me. |
| 10:24:32 | stevenknight | CoryCohen: are you under Cygwin? |
| 10:24:36 | CoryCohen | Windows, cygwin, cut-and-pasted the test case. |
| 10:24:37 | Greg_Noel | So it's fixed now, by something other that us? |
| 10:24:44 | stevenknight | no, i don't think it's fixed |
| 10:25:02 | CoryCohen | The shell should not care about the space (or lack thereof). |
| 10:25:05 | stevenknight | under cygwin you're using their UNIX-shell derivative |
| 10:25:14 | CoryCohen | I'm deeply suspicious of a not-real bash shell. |
| 10:25:17 | stevenknight | i think this is about using Windows' cmd.exe |
| 10:25:43 | CoryCohen | Yeah. That's mote likely, but the reporter appears to have ls, etc. |
| 10:26:09 | stevenknight | ah, true |
| 10:26:15 | stevenknight | maybe it *is* fixed then... |
| 10:26:25 | CoryCohen | Not that I'm against fixing it, but I think it's the shell that broken. |
| 10:26:25 | stevenknight | hang, on, let me boot up my Windows laptop |
| 10:26:34 | JimRandall | Agreed - it doesn't run under plain vanilla windows |
| 10:26:34 | stevenknight | i'll test it on a non-Cygwin system while we move on |
| 10:26:51 | CoryCohen | Ok. |
| 10:26:54 | JimRandall | the /dev/null |
| 10:27:08 | JimRandall | It can't find that file for some reason :) |
| 10:28:08 | Greg_Noel | 695: I'm not sure get_contents is the right API to expose |
| 10:28:21 | stevenknight | 662: dup 1882 |
| 10:28:42 | stevenknight | 695: agree w/Greg |
| 10:28:49 | Greg_Noel | 662: done |
| 10:29:35 | stevenknight | 695: I'd prefer to expose something called read() so it looks like a Python file handle |
| 10:29:56 | bdbaddog2007 | should we just make a note on the bug, and open a feature request bug with what you want to do for 2.x ? |
| 10:30:05 | stevenknight | sounds good |
| 10:30:07 | bdbaddog2007 | 695 that is, and close it ? |
| 10:30:28 | Greg_Noel | ok, done (but note that Value already has read) |
| 10:31:04 | Greg_Noel | 720 |
| 10:31:57 | Greg_Noel | Ah, I think you're right about Rob; Mark Flacy for Java. |
| 10:32:52 | stevenknight | 659: it works even under vanilla Windoze |
| 10:32:55 | stevenknight | FIXED |
| 10:33:04 | stevenknight | 720: agree re: Rob |
| 10:33:16 | stevenknight | and Mark (if he's interested) |
| 10:33:45 | stevenknight | Greg, would you either approach them yourself, or be a burr under my saddle for me to do it? |
| 10:33:52 | Greg_Noel | I'll write them. |
| 10:33:55 | stevenknight | I suck at staying on-task with that sort of things... |
| 10:34:11 | Greg_Noel | Me, too, but I have a nag list... |
| 10:34:28 | stevenknight | okay, on to 2008? |
| 10:34:34 | Greg_Noel | I'll also ask Rob if he thinks it's fixed. |
| 10:34:39 | Greg_Noel | yes, 2008 |
| 10:34:40 | stevenknight | cool |
| 10:35:06 | Greg_Noel | 1872 |
| 10:35:16 | stevenknight | 1872: consensus 2.x, p2 |
| 10:35:27 | Greg_Noel | I noticed this was from David, so I recanted. |
| 10:36:02 | stevenknight | meaning you're okay with that consensus? |
| 10:36:28 | Greg_Noel | No, I originally suggested 2.x; I recanted and now suggest 1.x. |
| 10:36:44 | stevenknight | oh, I see |
| 10:36:57 | Greg_Noel | I'm still ok with 2.x, but if we're giving David things to do... |
| 10:37:34 | Greg_Noel | Why not 2.x and ask him if he thinks it can be 1.x? |
| 10:37:41 | stevenknight | sure, if he's up for it. 1.x. worst that happens is we end up pushing it out |
| 10:37:46 | stevenknight | i'd say go the other way |
| 10:37:52 | Greg_Noel | ok, done. |
| 10:37:58 | stevenknight | make sure we at least consider it for 1.x and push out if need be |
| 10:38:10 | stevenknight | instead of having things on the 2.x list that we don't consider pulling in |
| 10:38:46 | Greg_Noel | 1873 |
| 10:38:56 | stevenknight | 1873: 1.x, p2 |
| 10:39:07 | Greg_Noel | Ouch. You sure? |
| 10:39:23 | stevenknight | i think trying to do something more friendly with this stuff sooner rather than later is important |
| 10:39:29 | Greg_Noel | ok, done. |
| 10:39:43 | stevenknight | not sure if it wil actually make it by then, but we should try |
| 10:40:03 | Greg_Noel | 1874 |
| 10:40:07 | bdbaddog2007 | :) |
| 10:40:17 | bdbaddog2007 | I'm not sure my bug report on this one captured the issue. |
| 10:40:26 | * | ita (n=ita@57.Red-83-60-116.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #scons |
| 10:40:48 | Greg_Noel | yes, it did. I just don't see any general solution. |
| 10:40:55 | stevenknight | right |
| 10:41:11 | bdbaddog2007 | I link a binary against libtcl8.4.so, which needs to be installed in a directory which is the LIBPATH, scons doesn't install it prior to the link so link fails. |
| 10:41:15 | Greg_Noel | How can you tell when the dot is a suffix or part of the name. |
| 10:41:20 | stevenknight | always adding the suffix is wrong for some configurations. not adding the suffix is wrong for some configurations |
| 10:41:40 | bdbaddog2007 | this is specifically for shared library names. |
| 10:42:13 | Greg_Noel | Well, is it the same for .dylib? .pylib? .dll? |
| 10:42:30 | Greg_Noel | Too many variations. |
| 10:42:48 | bdbaddog2007 | this is for shared libraries found by findlib |
| 10:43:16 | bdbaddog2007 | where it trys a number of name variations. |
| 10:43:30 | bdbaddog2007 | with and without suffix, but in this case doesn't try suffix. |
| 10:44:20 | Greg_Noel | Does the workaround work? |
| 10:45:11 | stevenknight | oh, okay, so this is in Scanner/Prog.py, yes? |
| 10:45:31 | bdbaddog2007 | hold on lemme bring up the file. |
| 10:45:51 | bdbaddog2007 | actually if you want we can defer this bug til later. |
| 10:46:09 | stevenknight | yeah, i found it |
| 10:46:11 | Greg_Noel | yes, table, discuss in mailing list. |
| 10:46:26 | stevenknight | it's a real bug |
| 10:46:41 | stevenknight | table and discuss |
| 10:46:53 | Greg_Noel | 1897, dup, three agreed |
| 10:47:12 | stevenknight | you mean 1879, yes? |
| 10:47:14 | bdbaddog2007 | 1879 right? |
| 10:47:32 | Greg_Noel | sigh, dyslexia... |
| 10:47:53 | stevenknight | dyslexics of the world untie! |
| 10:48:14 | stevenknight | (I get to say that because both my wife and daughter are...) |
| 10:48:31 | Greg_Noel | makes sense to me... |
| 10:48:36 | stevenknight | 1880: |
| 10:49:00 | stevenknight | 1880: 2.x, drop it even to p4? |
| 10:49:02 | Greg_Noel | Didn't Gary also report a 1880-ish issue? |
| 10:49:22 | stevenknight | this is the sort of thing Benoit is really good at tracking down |
| 10:49:38 | Greg_Noel | good idea, I'll ask him. Next? |
| 10:50:00 | stevenknight | 1883: much less an issue with the scons.bat patch |
| 10:50:35 | stevenknight | i'd like to put it under the general windows installation umbrella |
| 10:50:43 | Greg_Noel | works for me |
| 10:50:46 | stevenknight | however we decide to actually record that... |
| 10:51:18 | bdbaddog2007 | wiki page? or a bug which depends on other bugs ? |
| 10:51:24 | Greg_Noel | Why don't I create a keyword? |
| 10:51:30 | bdbaddog2007 | I usually like the bug which depends on other bugs.. |
| 10:51:49 | stevenknight | i like both the keyword and the umbrella bug |
| 10:51:59 | bdbaddog2007 | even better.. |
| 10:52:00 | bdbaddog2007 | :) |
| 10:52:01 | Greg_Noel | ok, I'll work something up |
| 10:52:04 | Greg_Noel | next? |
| 10:52:05 | stevenknight | thanks |
| 10:52:35 | stevenknight | 1885: see if Rob Managan will take it? |
| 10:52:39 | Greg_Noel | I'll ask Rob |
| 10:52:44 | stevenknight | done |
| 10:52:46 | Greg_Noel | next |
| 10:53:37 | stevenknight | 1889: consensus research |
| 10:53:41 | Greg_Noel | we've been seeing a bunch of these lately; there was another on the mailing list day before yesterday. |
| 10:53:50 | bdbaddog2007 | yes saw that. |
| 10:53:58 | Greg_Noel | research, who? |
| 10:54:15 | stevenknight | Jim, you had some exposure to the problem...? |
| 10:54:19 | JimRandall | Aye - it bit me |
| 10:54:28 | JimRandall | Tried to create a reproducible case, but had a hard time |
| 10:54:35 | bdbaddog2007 | would this be related to the other bug dealing with caching and the contents of a directory changing? |
| 10:54:37 | JimRandall | seems to be because boost/algorithm (a directory) |
| 10:54:59 | JimRandall | has a file that refers to the C++ STL file algorithm |
| 10:55:17 | JimRandall | So possibly a saved result in a .sconsign causing trouble |
| 10:55:23 | JimRandall | or a scanner issue? |
| 10:55:28 | stevenknight | hmm, that might be enough to go on |
| 10:55:30 | stevenknight | probably scanner |
| 10:55:39 | stevenknight | put my name on it, leave it research |
| 10:55:46 | Greg_Noel | done, next? |
| 10:56:01 | stevenknight | 1891: me, research, p3 |
| 10:56:13 | stevenknight | i'm taking a fresh look at the windows support in general |
| 10:56:21 | Greg_Noel | ok, done, next? |
| 10:56:22 | nano- | Sorry to bounce in with an OT question. Is there any way to get a list of tools intialized, and their corresponding classes, so you can call exists() from a Configure check. |
| 10:57:15 | Greg_Noel | 1894, future, three votes |
| 10:57:36 | stevenknight | nano-: calling env.Tool() on each tool in your list? |
| 10:57:51 | stevenknight | 1894: done |
| 10:58:20 | Greg_Noel | skip 1896 |
| 10:58:22 | stevenknight | 1895: i'd say research, gary (overall toolchain refactor) |
| 10:58:28 | nano- | stevenknight: Huh.. it does? I tried adding a print, but it was at least hidden. |
| 10:58:42 | nano- | stevenknight: Also, no matter what that method returns, the tool is still generated. |
| 10:58:53 | stevenknight | nano-: not sure I understand your original question |
| 10:59:30 | stevenknight | nano-: oh, you mean just get the list of Tool modules *without* having them call generate()? |
| 10:59:33 | nano- | stevenknight: Well, my original question was to get env.Configure to check if my tools exist, so I wanted to get hold on the tools so that I could access their .exists methods. |
| 10:59:50 | nano- | Because tools are loaded even if their executables aren't found. |
| 11:00:53 | nano- | So lets say I have env.Detect(foo) in my exists(env) in my tool, and it returns None, (or whatever) SCons still generates the tool. |
| 11:00:55 | Greg_Noel | 1895, not sure it's toolchain. Sounds like Detect() |
| 11:01:23 | stevenknight | nano-: no good public API for doing what you want |
| 11:01:58 | stevenknight | nano-: look in Tool/__init__.py for things that might get you close |
| 11:02:10 | nano- | So what's the reason for exists() in Tools anyway? As it doesn't seem to matter what it does. |
| 11:02:31 | stevenknight | nano-: specifically things like Findtool(), FindAllTools() |
| 11:02:55 | stevenknight | nano-: exists() is used by the default search, but the presumption is if you call env.Tool() you're specifically asking to have the module applied |
| 11:03:32 | Greg_Noel | 1895, put on Gary's plate to research? |
| 11:03:39 | stevenknight | Greg_Noel: 1895, gary, research |
| 11:03:41 | nano- | Yeah, but env.Tool() will fail if the executables aren't found? |
| 11:03:47 | Greg_Noel | done |
| 11:03:50 | nano- | Not that I've noticed. |
| 11:04:17 | nano- | Oh, nevermind.. go on with your bug talks instead of this one. |
| 11:04:25 | stevenknight | 1896: skip, alrady integrated |
| 11:04:26 | Greg_Noel | 1900 |
| 11:04:57 | Greg_Noel | where is the intel() tool used? |
| 11:05:14 | ita | stevenknight: is the great signature refactoring complete? |
| 11:06:25 | Greg_Noel | Sigh. Should we just stop? We're getting more interruptions than work done. |
| 11:06:30 | stevenknight | 1900: not sure, this strikes me as another gary research |
| 11:06:59 | stevenknight | Greg_Noel: yeah, we should stop -- i have to peel off soon anyway |
| 11:07:03 | stevenknight | ita: hey Thomas |
| 11:07:13 | Greg_Noel | ok, I'll put it on his plate. |
| 11:07:14 | stevenknight | yes, the signature refactoring was released in 0.98.0 |
| 11:07:35 | stevenknight | "complete" is a relative word... :-) |
| 11:07:36 | Greg_Noel | 1901, done. |
| 11:07:49 | ita | stevenknight: ok, thanks |
| 11:08:03 | stevenknight | some side effects are still turning up, but they're in increasingly obscure corner cases |
| 11:09:22 | Greg_Noel | 1904, I think this just showed up in the wiki; what to do with it otherwise? |
| 11:10:37 | Greg_Noel | future, what priority? |
| 11:11:03 | bdbaddog2007 | if he can get some test together could we pull it in? shouldn't impact anything else right? |
| 11:12:07 | Greg_Noel | We lack a general framework for _any_ testing; without that, this will just change when we do. |
| 11:13:29 | bdbaddog2007 | looks like he's just created a builder. if we treat it like a builder in the near term and address a testing framework later, would that be acceptable? |
| 11:13:44 | stevenknight | bdbaddog2007: that could work |
| 11:14:08 | Greg_Noel | fine with me; Bill, you want to chase it? |
| 11:14:20 | bdbaddog2007 | sure. |
| 11:14:31 | CoryCohen | Well guys, the wife says it's time to go get some food. Thanks for the help earlier -- I've made some progress using an emitter, but I still need help. Rather than interrupt your bug tracking, I'll send mail to dev later today. |
| 11:14:39 | Greg_Noel | ok,I'll assign it to you. |
| 11:14:55 | stevenknight | CoryCohen: thanks for checking in |
| 11:15:10 | CoryCohen | It's been educational for me. :-) |
| 11:15:33 | CoryCohen | Bye! |
| 11:15:54 | Greg_Noel | 1905, don't know what to suggest. |
| 11:16:42 | bdbaddog2007 | Float a message on user and dev mailing lists sugguesting retiring this and see what feedback there is? |
| 11:17:04 | Greg_Noel | Works. Who should send it? Steven? |
| 11:17:15 | stevenknight | probably |
| 11:17:38 | Greg_Noel | ok, you for research? |
| 11:17:42 | * | Administrator (n=chatzill@38.119.251.180) has joined #scons |
| 11:17:42 | stevenknight | yeah |
| 11:18:01 | * | Administrator is now known as Azverkan |
| 11:19:04 | stevenknight | 1906: greg and i were talking about it earlier |
